If you’ve ever wrestled with the unsolicited “When are you having kids?” or heard, “But you’d be such a great mother,” this episode is here for you. Karena sits down with Ruby Warrington, author, podcast host, and creator of the Sober Curious movement, to explore her child-free journey and what it means to live outside societal expectations. Ruby’s new book and podcast, Women Without Kids, is out now and is creating a new kind of legacy for women—one rooted in healing and empowerment.

Breaking Stigma of Women Without Kids

In this conversation, Ruby and Karena both open up about their complex family histories; touching on how factors like family lineage, genetics, and the experience of being “parentified” profoundly shaped their perspectives on motherhood. Ruby shares how she and her husband have navigated the decision to remain child-free over the years, choosing to live a life that is true to them despite societal pressures. Karena and Ruby also explore how normalized it is for society to question or even dismiss women without children, expressing how this experience of “othering” can feel isolating. Together, they delve into the nuances of making such a deeply personal choice, including confronting the grief and complexity of remaining child-free and finding fulfillment in chosen families.

Through their own stories of breaking free from expectations, they emphasize the importance of empathy, understanding, and respect for each person’s unique journey. Whether it’s fur babies, close friendships, or a workout community, there are countless ways to build a full and meaningful life!

(00:04:51) How The Way We Were Mothered Influences the Decision to Mother

• How normalized it is in our society to dismiss the experience of women without children
• How political the decision to have kids or not has become
• How our experience of being mothered has impacted our feelings about becoming mothers
• The complexities and instability Ruby experienced growing up
• The way parentification influences development and causes anxiety

(00:17:57) Normalizing The Nuances of Being Child-Free

• How an unplanned pregnancy led to her first conversation with her partner about children
• How she and her husband have navigating the decision to have children or not through the years
• The expectation versus reality of imagining if you want to have children
• Unpacking the statement: “But you would be such a great mother”
• Confronting the grief and complexity of this decision

(00:27:16) Facing Genetic Challenges & Generational Stigmas

• How family lineage and genetics influence the choice to have children or not
• The importance of questioning the capacity to care for a child with disabilities
• Embracing being fun aunts and uncles and the dynamics of having friends with children
• How to answer the question, “why don’t you have kids?” from family and strangers
• Our favorite child free role models
• Recognizing the stigma of not having grandchildren on our parents

(00:42:22) Creating Chosen Family, Embracing Empathy & Redefining Norms

• The beauty of fur children and creating family outside of our biological ties
• A reminder about the importance of empathy and not judging people’s choices
• Destigmatizing family dysfunction and knowing that it’s the norm, not the exception
• How being an introvert or extrovert can impact having children
• Developing a healthy relationship with alcohol and being sober curious

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Guest Info:

• Website: rubywarrington.com
• Instagram: @rubywarrington
• Podcast: Women Without Kids
• Read: Women Without Kids by Ruby Warrington

Resources:

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“The Big Silence” theme song written and performed by James Nicholas Kinney.

Producer, Bobby Goldstein.